And ever since we've been married, we have always lived with other people. Our reasoning is this: Jerry and I really love hanging out with each other and can tend to want to stay at home and hang out rather than go out. Living with other people is an automatic social life, it's cheaper, it's a great way to make really good friends and meet new people through your roommates.
We love this lifestyle and have thought about what we will do when we decide we want to have children. And then we realized - why can't we have our cake and eat it, too? On top of that, why can't we create the kind of Jewish community we dream of? Thus, our idea of creating an irbutz was born. Ir in Hebrew means city, and butz is taken from the word kibbutz, a form of communal living in Israel. [Side note: We didn't come up with the name or the concept, apparently there are Jews out there like us who have already done this thing.]
The idea is this: live together in a huge house in a city (Jerry's thought - buy an old embassy in DC) with a few other Jewish families. Have regular Shabbat dinners together, celebrate all of the Jewish holidays together, create a community.
Much of the reasoning behind this is our desire to raise our children within a Jewish community. In modern-day American Jewry, the center of Jewish life outside of the family is the synagogue - and while we believe that synagogues are important, we also believe that there should be Jewish communities available to Jews from all different backgrounds. Our irbutz would provide a Jewish home to the broader Jewish community of all ages - Shabbat dinners, Jewish discussions, movie nights, and holiday celebrations would all take place there.
This idea was also inspired by Moishe House, an organization that sets up group houses for 20-something Jews in cities all over the world. Their rent is subsidized in exchange for running events for young Jews in that city. The concept was that Jews in their 20s were falling out of touch with the Jewish community - beyond college, but not ready to join a synagogue. Moishe House is working to fill that gap. We see our irbutz as a natural extension of this concept, a community center that is open to people of all ages. We have also thought about pitching this idea to existing Jewish organizations (like Moishe House) to seek out funding.
There are lots of questions to answer, here are only a few:
- Who would we live with? How many families would live there? What are the guidelines for selecting who lives in the house?
- Where would we do this?
- What are the rules of the irbutz? What is shared? How would food work? How would money work for communal expenses? How do you resolve disputes? What are legal ramifications? How do we divide up chores?
- What exactly does it mean to make this home Jewish? This is obviously a question that comes up even if you aren't living in an irbutz. What do you do on a daily basis to make your home Jewish, to incorporate Judaism into your family life? Why is this important?
If you have any thoughts on more questions that need to be asked or general feedback on the concept, leave them in the comments. Also, if you know anyone who currently lives or has previously lived on an irbutz or someone who you think would be interested, please let us know!
Don't you think there is a risk of becoming kind of close minded if you live only with jews ? (It also works with catholics,muslims, taoists, republicans,veggies...)Great things in life are about meet different people, from different countries, with other religious point of view. I could not imagine myself living only with catholics...
ReplyDeleteSince bikkur cholim and honoring your mother and your father are two major mitzvot, your irbutz definitely needs to have space for elderly parents.
ReplyDeleteVal - in general, I think your point is valid. But look at it this way - most people don't raise their children with a bunch of other people, usually it's just the parent(s)/family. If we were to raise our children in a "normal" house with just the two of us, then our kids would be raised in a Jewish home. It's important to us for our children to be raised with a Jewish identity, and thus they should be raised in a Jewish home. Jerry and I have always lived with people from all different backgrounds (currently living with a French guy and a Colombian woman) - but when it comes to creating a home for our children, we want it to be Jewish.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, one of the reasons I want to raise our kids in the U.S. is because I love the diversity there. I grew up with people from all different backgrounds and that is an invaluable experience to have.
The interesting thing about diversity is that, in order for diversity to exist, people have to have unique identities and backgrounds. In order to have your own background, you have to come from somewhere, you have to be raised a certain way. We want our kids to value diversity and have friends from all backgrounds, but also to understand where it is that they come from.
Robin, the idea is great hypothetically, but anything socialist will be complicated to organize. And the trick is to finding a happy medium between sharing and owning. By human nature we don't always want to share. It should be calculated so that it makes sense financially to enter the house, live in the house, and leave the house at any point in time. There should also be clear definitions of who owns what, and what is shared.
ReplyDeleteSome questions/areas of concern:
- The organization of it would be completely different if you have an group like Moishe House subsidizing rent, and bringing their rules to the house, or if you elect a 'leader' to organize the house.
- The idea behind Kibbutzim is that everyone works together to make money by selling some products and to run the community. Nowadays, a lot of members have started to work outside. But similar to the Kibbutz, if you give people chores, they should be considered as 'jobs' with salaries, and maybe it works out that if someone works full time on just chores and running the house, this person does not have to put in additional money to the house.
- What if a member joins and is quite poor, or looses their job? Are they kicked out of the house because they cannot put in their part? What if a member is very ill, and their full time job was taking care of this house. Does the house cover their medical bills? A Kibbutz would still take care of this member. I assume the Irbutz cannot.
- What if a bunch of members want to get together to buy a new couch or fridge? Should all members pitch in? Should it come from a general house account? What if not everyone agrees? Who is the deciding voice?
- How much money should each family put in? Should it increase per members of the family? Should it increase if you make a higher salary? Should aid be provided if you have kids?
- Are there penalties to leaving? Do you have to commit to a time frame?
- Shared things should be: food, bills, laundry, cleaning, maybe even share a car. There should be a private room for each family, a fun room, dining room, work room, etc.
Again, the idea is great theoretically! But you will need defined rules and a happy medium to get this working.
Yaara - thanks so much for your thoughtful comments and questions! It definitely would not be a socialist living situation - perhaps the word irshav would be more accurate. You bring up some really good points - especially about what to do if someone loses their job/becomes sick/etc. Also, you make a good point in that, if we got outside funding to help cover costs, we would also be held accountable by those people and probably need to adhere to their requirements.
ReplyDeleteI think these questions would first need to be addressed by Jerry and me to set our own framework for how the house would work. But then, more importantly, it would need to be discussed with the first set of irbutzniks, with clear answers to these and many more questions. The issue of communication and decision-making is key.
In our minds, each family gets their own wing of the house, with the kitchen, living room, and dining room, possibly a garden and kids' room as common areas.
(hi Robin, thibault the other french coming in four months)
ReplyDeleteCommunity need rules, yet is not defined by it so much that designed by a common will to balance. If applied any concept needs adjustments, thus you need people keen enough on the idea of harmony by rules yet who can display flexibility, social intelligence and a sens of self denial.
This last ability you might find in believers as they are dedicated and willing to bow to a greater sens as invisible as it may. However, since religion will be in the central idea and motivation it could potentially be the center of disagreement at the end.
This raises the question :
Are you looking for a common perception of your religion ?
If yes, it limits your initial idea of mixity and open mindedness
If no you may find the center of the concept challenged by reality (how far can you make abstraction of your nature in the name of your ideal ? Will other people go as far as you ?)
Thinking life is different than living it and one is if over controlled or controlling or conscious of the control dummed to eventually loose it.
To continue on Val's comment and your answer. I get what you are saying about the need of a child to be conscious of his identity. It is true to a certain extent that it won't prevent him from mixing. Yet it is in human nature for transmission to be alienating, for kids or people to construct by mimetism. Once alienated, a personn tends to reject the unknown, what is different in order to protect himself of facing the challenge of doubt.
This is the problem of communitarianism which could be a side effect of the project.
I would tend to believe that in order for your project to come threw, you'll need to define absoluts (rules, values that are not to be too challenged). You might need to take stand stronger than you'd want, thereby setting aside the idea of doubt and perhaps hardening yourself within dogma.
Love the comments. Thibault, I really like your point about finding people who share are same concept of Judaism. That's a good point that I hadn't thought of. Orthodox would be unworkable from a logistical standpoint (i.e. I love shellfish and bacon), but I would say that anything less observant than Orthodox should work just fine.
ReplyDeleteA lot of these concerns are common to any kind of group living situation - whether it's several families living together or just 4 people in Bogota. Certain things are shared, certain things are private, and in general, you need to be laid back. Clearly, though, these issues become highlighted when you start involving children. If you're roommates decide to get high every night for a few weeks, it might be annoying, but if you have kids...
Good talk.
I also agree with Thibault about the idea of sharing the same religious point of view. Isn't it true as well for political values ? I know you guys got some liberal views on different things like gay wedding, or secularism... This is not something any people who is "less observant than Orthodox" is ready to understand.
ReplyDeleteI don't say that you got to live with people who think exactly the same way than you, but i think you definitely need to share also some non-religious values with the people in the Irbutz if you want to raise your kids with them.
A lot of interesting comments. Jerry, remember Edison Circle in our neighborhood is something like this. Several Jewish families, all with young children, all bought lots on Edison Circle so they could all live on the same street. That might be a bit simpler than sharing a house. You take turns going to different houses for dinner. Of course, you need an undeveloped plot of land to do it!
ReplyDeleteJust one question - Jerry is the more fashionable one????? My Jerry? Ben yes, but Jerry fashionable?
;o)
The idea of an Irbutz makes me so excited, especially since I've spent the past year living in a communal situation and discussing the kibbutz (in all its forms. I think that the first step is to find a group of people who are willing to live in a semi/socialist situation. Beyond that, everything that you figure out needs to be flexible and decided upon by the group. This is such a fabulous thing you guys have thought about doing! Who says the kibbutz has to stay in Israel. Also, just an FYI, there's an Irbutz in Seattle (Ravenna Kibbutz) that you might be interested in looking into their start-up process. Good Luck!
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